Author Topic: Feel so unlistened to  (Read 19341 times)

Sadgirl4

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Feel so unlistened to
« on: March 16, 2013, 01:02:14 AM »
Saw my psych today. Have been under his care for 7 years - he is a good guy. This current depression started last march. Have tried 3 different antidepressants and augmenting agents, had ECT and a spell in hospital. Worse than ever. Mental health been reorganised so can only see my psych if under the crisis team. They come every day and encourage me to do activities like going out for coffee, walks etc. if I don't "engage" with them I am told I am hostile and uncooperative, so I have really tried to work with them.
Told psych I am feeling the worst I have ever been, extremely suicidal with a plan, the means, my letters written etc. That the activities didn't do anything to distract me. That my other depressive symptoms were no better.  I hoped he would change meds.  He said I was at risk of a completed suicide.  Then said the antidepressant WAS working because I was working with the crisis team, and that he was cutting their visits from twice to once a day. That I should just postpone my suicide until I was more engaged in life and felt better.
How can he say the drugs are working in the same breath he tells me I'm at risk?  I wanted him to help because a tiny part of me (very tiny) doesn't want to die.  But the rest of me is overwhelmed by the need to finish this. He is now on holiday for two weeks, and his sub, very kind, doesn't like to alter his treatment plan. I don't have 2 weeks.

musicken

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2013, 03:48:15 AM »
Hi Sadgirl

I'm sorry to hear you're struggling.   We're all here to listen.  I know there's not much I can say, but I hope you can hold on. 

What would make you feel more listened to?  is there any one thing that would make a difference?  is there anyone else you can talk to nearby?

Sadgirl4

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2013, 10:06:53 AM »
Hi Musicken
Other than him doing something with meds? I guess an acknowledgement of how tough it is to live with suicidal feelings, and some real help with them.  One or two of the crisis team are great, but it's a lottery who turns up.  A lovely guy came two nights ago (I had met him before because he works on the ward where I was) and he said he felt I was in a deep hole and he wanted to throw me a rope to rescue me. Now I feel like my psych has cut off all chance of escape.
Can't talk to hubby - have tried. Best friend is waiting to see if her cancer has returned, so can't burden her.  Most of friends have found severity and length of this episode too hard to handle and have melted away.
My protective factors are no longer protective.  My psych has got it into his head I won't act for 3 weeks.  He is wrong.  He says I am just feeling bad because I have lost my roles through being ill so long.  That I need help to re-engage.  He is wrong.  If I was recovering, I would have no problems with having coffee with people, or going into town. I never have before, and have 14 years of experience.  I know my symptoms aren't lifting. I have been on these meds for 14 weeks. If they were going to work......
Guess its my fault for not getting him to explain how I can be getting better and still be so suicidal, for not pushing for a change in meds. Instead I just left and cried.

musicken

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2013, 01:50:08 PM »
Hi Sadgirl

I've been sitting here for nearly an hour trying to write a reply but I'm not finding myself very articulate this morning afternoon, so it's proving tricky.
Without knowing you, I'm conscious of accidentally saying/asking something that's been said over and over, or triggers further feelings of isolation, so if I accidentally do so, I apologise in advance.

Some of what you've said is familiar territory for me too;  Although I've so far avoided crisis teams and wards, I've also had to live with intrusive suicidal feelings for much of my adult life.  It's very draining and those who've never been there won't ever be able to understand.
Is there something that triggers these feelings?  are they constant, or do you have periods of time where you can function without them intruding as much?   

I've had bad experiences with psychs too, quite often I've gone away from a session feeling much worse. Fortunately I had one or two people I was able to turn to and speak to them on the phone, or by text. Just knowing that there was someone to say 'there there' was enough for me. 

But you can escape, this forum could be a rescue rope of sorts.
Is there a reason you can't talk to your husband?  I can't really talk to my wife for a number of reasons. she doesn't understand depression at all, often tells me I'm being silly when the mood makes me really low. Also, there's other issues in our marriage that are forcing me to build a wall for no other reason than to protect myself.   Not being able to talk to one's spouse about important issues is such a bad thing, and it certainly doesn't help me feel any better.  So I'm here instead treating this forum like an anonymous group-therapy session.
Sorry to hear that your friend is poorly, and I can understand why you don't want to burden her at the moment. So, 'burden' us instead. By that I mean you'd not be a burden, we're all here for the same reason.  If there are things that you don't feel comfortable talking about in the open forum, you can always turn to private messages when you find some people here that you feel you can trust enough.

It's not your fault for not getting him to explain, by the way.  it's his fault for not explaining.  Your thought processes will be muddy through the depression and the medication, so don't blame yourself.   Could you write it all down in a letter to your psych instead of worrying about going to pieces at you next session?

It might be worth looking at things to help you cope.  For me, listening to ambient/atmospheric/drone music on headphones often works to drown out the world for a spell.  Once the weather improves I hope to start taking evening walks, again with headphones on, listening to Audiobooks to help me concentrate.  People in my group therapy session have mentioned 'mindfulness' as a technique and we got a handout on it but I've not had a chance to explore it, but at it's simplest it is picking some task and doing it mindfully - even something like doing the dishes; removing all distractions and concentrating on the task.

Would going for a short, five minute walk every day help? you could gradually build up the time perhaps?   Sometimes the thought of having to interact with other people can be too much, so what about going for a coffee on your own? or is it the thought of being around people?

Don't give in, though. keep fighting through, even if the vision of screaming at your psych in your next meeting is the only thing keeping you going.

I hope this helps somehow.   Am here if you need to vent more, as are others.
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Pip

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2013, 05:47:34 PM »
I am very concerned with your doctor's attitude towards your suicidal thoughts.  It doesn't matter if he believes there is a tiny bit of you that wont go through with it.  Many years ago I had a friend whose girlfriend's husband (they had been separated for some time) kept threatening to commit suicide knowing she would go running to him.  Each time he hadn't taken enough tablets or whiskey to actually die.  Eventually she thought she had 'wised up' to him so she didn't go running the last time he rang her.  That time he succeeded and it took her a long time to forgive herself.  Sorry for being morbid but if someone says they are suicidal I always take it seriously.

I know posting here isn't the same as actually speaking to someone f2f but members will take you seriously how you're feeling.  For years I have been suicidal but I'm in a place now that I wont actually do anything because there is enough within me to know that I have things to live for.  It also helps knowing I have friends who care about me.  It can be hard though battling against suicidal thoughts though.  Keep  posting for support though.

Catbrian

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2013, 01:07:39 AM »
My last Psychiatrist was like this, he would never seem to take me seriously.  One day, coming off meds, I called him desperately suicidal; I have never been nearer it in my entire life.  I gave him a mouthful, but remember little, I told him how suicidal I was, explained all about him not listening and leaving me large amounts of time without any support.  He spoke to me for less than 4 minutes and simply said, "Hang on in there, I will see you again in three weeks".

I've got to admit, it was a real crisis point for me, but it was also a turning point.  I realised that I was on my own.  There was absolutely nothing anyone could do or say that would make me feel better.  The only person to do that was myself.  I decided to stand up for myself and proceeded to kick up a fuss.  I got a new Psychiatrist who does listen and an excellent CPN.

Suicide is a means to end our pain, our inner torture.  As utterly desperate as many of us become, few of us really want to die.  Recovery is a long road.  Yes, it eventually gets to going into Town without a second thought, or meeting friends for coffee, but first recovery needs to start within, sometimes with the little small steps.  By the sounds of it, you have already come a long way. 

I hope you can find a way to press forward

Leo

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2013, 09:13:42 PM »
You aren't alone.

I complained of suicidal thoughts for many months, preogressively getting worse. One day I did take a load of pills to escape from how I was feeling. My occupational health saw me the next day and said they had no idea where that came from, they couldn't understand me taking those pills. I was like where have you been all these months?

I'm not sure what to advise you, but this forum was a great help to me in my darkest hours.
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Catbrian

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2013, 09:46:16 PM »
Sometimes it does feel as if they are not listening.  I used to wonder if they somehow thought I wasn't exactly with them, maybe too high on medication; like I wouldn't notice if they just pretend not to hear me from time to time.  It made me wonder how many people who commit suicide do tell their MH worker prior to doing it but the worker doesn't really listen.  After all, it's only another bonkers patient or client rabbiting on about their miserable life

Sadgirl4

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2013, 10:10:00 PM »
My psych usually does listen to me.  Mental health services are undergoing reorganisation so he now only sees patients under crisis team. I think he is struggling with changes, and it feels like our relationship has changed and my voice doesn't count compared to what he is told by the crisis team.
Crisis team are talking about hospital again. I will not be safer there, and being admitted makes things worse.  My psych said he wouldn't section me - have to hope he really meant it. Crisis team asked me to list my reasons for not killing myself. I could only come up with three, and two of those I found arguments against. Don't know what I am going to do - the suicidal thoughts are becoming overwhelming, and the pressure to act increasing.

Catbrian

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2013, 10:34:57 PM »
When's the next time you're due to see Psych?  Maybe if you can even phone or request an appointment.  I think it is one of the worst things is when we're desperately depressed but no one is taking us seriously.  Of course, if you do reach that point of acting on those thoughts, you must make contact with the crisis team.  Sometimes we need that extra support, especially if our own safety is at risk. 

I remember feeling similar hopelessness and helplessness, not that long ago.  My desperation no longer even wanted to get better.  The days..weeks...months... are a blur, but I can never forget that gut wrenching despair.

There's no point me saying "things will get better", you've heard them all so often, you've probably become desensitised.  I can only tell you that, for me, and many more depressives, have found a way back from their own personal hell's.  There's no secret route or magic potion, only sitting it out; fighting each day to survive and, most importantly, holding onto a blind faith that things might one day feel better.

I hope you can find some support from the Depression Forum

musicken

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #10 on: March 18, 2013, 01:01:30 AM »
Sadgirl, I'm sorry to read that you're still struggling.  Like Catb there's little point in me saying stuff like "it will get better". I can only hope that it does improve for you.

But you are among people who fully understand and can offer support on here.

I've not got much in the way of practical suggestions, I'm afraid.  I'm only really able to offer an ear, or shoulder.

stewart

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2013, 04:00:05 PM »
Hi Sadgirl,
sorry to see you are having such a bad time, psycs can at times be useless in their comments, each person is an individual and if they dont fit into a predefined textbook pigeon hole many psycs often dont know what to do or say.

I often wonder if they take people serious if they are not a textbook case, if they really do understand depression or know much at all, are they just parroting lines from a textbook they read....
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Sadgirl4

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2013, 07:44:37 PM »
Hi Stewart
Certainly feel that is the case with the crisis team. Their answer to everything is to distract myself. I am sick of telling them that distractions don't distract me - that the thoughts are too persistent.  They just don't listen. Yesterday I told one of the better ones that walking the dog kept me safe because I wouldn't want to harm him, only myself. Today I was told to walk the dog "because you said it was distracting". So I explained for the umpteenth time that distractions don't work and yes I have tried. Just before she left she asked if I had any plans for the rest of the day.  Perhaps You could walk the dog because you find it cathartic. Give me strength.
She also said I should accept that other people might see things I don't in terms of my improvement. It's great to know the crisis team have a better grasp of what is going on in my head than I do.  That in spite of escalating suicidality thoughts and symptoms of severe depression that are not reducing (my Beckmann depression inventory scores for the last 6 weeks, earliest first, are 52, 53, 58) I am getting better. All they are basing their conclusion on is the fact I am talking to them about how I feel.  But if I don't, I'll get sent back to cmht, and they are even worse. She seemed to think I was assuming they thought I was well, rather than getting better.  So missed the point.  Do they think I have made up my mind to stay depressed and not to recover, to deny signs of recovery? Well anyone who has been depressed knows you wouldn't wish this on your worst enemy, and would do anything not to be in this state.  Don't they realise I frantically look for the smallest sign that things are changing?  There is none.
More great wisdom - if there is a tiny part of you that doesn't want to die, you need to make that part bigger.  If I could do that, doesn't she think I would have?  They just don't get the overwhelming nature of the desire to die and be free from these cycles. Sometimes I wonder if they have ever seen anyone with severe treatment resistant depression before.
Today I packed away all my clothes, ready to be taken to charity shop when I am gone. Now, crisis team, THAT was cathartic.

Catbrian

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2013, 08:52:46 PM »
I understand about the "distraction techniques", they don't work for me either.  When my mood is down, and my head on a one track suicide road, nothing will distract me.  It's not that I want to be in that frame of mind, but it just doesn't cross my mind to deploy a distraction technique.

I walk my dog 2hrs every day.  I do it mainly to fulfil his high energy needs, but it is also a big help to me in managing my depression.  However, it still isn't a distraction from the depression because if I was down, I would only take that mood with me, ruminating as I go!  These MH workers who bang on about deploying distraction, don't appear to know what they are talking about.  I wonder if anyone has ever actually said, "oh, thank you, that technique really saved my life"

Sweetpea

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Re: Feel so unlistened to
« Reply #14 on: March 18, 2013, 09:03:56 PM »
Sometimes I don't think these people have any idea what its like to suffer  >:(.  I also would not wish depression on my worst enemy. I do not think people understand unless they have suffered themselves, but these are people trained to help. Why don't they listen!

When I am bad distraction techniques go out of the window as all I can think about is how bad I feel and nothing can  stop these feelings.

Really feel for you  :hug:.

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