Train suicide

[mar42]

Hi all,did anyone read the story of Donna oettinger committing suicide? such a tragic story,she had already tried to OD before & friends & family say she should have received more help. I've sometimes thought that my own GP doesn't really care,the last time i saw him,i was feeling suicidal & although he has always been sympathetic he has never phoned to see how i am just as a follow up. I know they are very busy & your family doctor seems to be a thing of the past & also there is not much they can really do,apart from upping or changing meds & sometimes this can make things worse. I remember reading years ago about a high suicide rate in depressed people who were taking sertraline,it's such a complex thing,because being depressed can of course bring on suicidal thoughts & sometimes even though these thoughts are distressing,they  can be useful in a way of helping you escape your situation for a moment or two. On the other hand do these anti-depressants make users feel more suicidal?. I myself take sertraline,which is also known as lustral or zoloft and is a ssri,they were the only thing that really worked for me,when my depression first hit. I started on 50mg,made a mistake of stopping abruptly after about 5 years of use & was upped to 150 mg which i still take now.

[Beetzart]

Interesting post, Mar.  Depression and it's treatment is rather paradoxical.  I have just had my venlafaxine upped (10 days ago) from 225 mg to 300 mg and I don't feel good mentally, but not suicidal just empty and despairing.  Hopefully this will pass as I tolerate it quite well.  I know what you mean about GPs, they haven't got a clue who you are even if you go say once a month, and would rather just prescribe low cost generic pills as this is cheaper then consultations.  I can't get an emergency appointment anymore it has to be over the telephone.  My GP happily prescribed tramadol for my back pain over the phone even though it interacts with most of the drugs I take by lowering the seizure threshold.  I'm lucky nothing happened and I am used to it now, but you never know.  I keep getting tramadol on repeat, no GP has ever followed it up.  Once I put in a request for all my meds, got them, then the Boots service I set up ordered more meds a few days later.  The doctor prescribed them.  None are narcotic but nevertheless it shows they don't really check their notes.  I think the admin staff do all repeats now and a GP just signs it en masse. 

I had a low lithium level before christmas.  My GP got his secretary to ring me so I could inform the mental health clinic I attend for him.  That could go horribly wrong.  Yet if you moan they strike you off.  It's a wonder more people don't end up seriously ill with this lackadaisical approach. 

 

[Catbrian]

Antidepressants is a funny old subject.  I watched something recently that suggests something like 60%+ is a placebo effect.  People on the trial were given placebo's and most were reporting improvement in their mood. 

One of the first AD's I tried was Prozac.  Wow! I thought I was losing my mind.  I was on sertraline for sometime and was having a problem coming off it; experiencing these very slight electric shock sensations from head to toe.  When I was complaining to the GP, he said I was imagining it and the Psychiatrist said he never heard of it.  A few months later, I watched a documentary about the problems people encounter on AD's.  Almost every person interviewed reported similar "electric shock" sensations coming off Sertraline.  I'm convinced some of these Pharmaceutical companies play down side effects and Doctor's go along with their text book guidelines.

I think on the whole, people benefit from AD's, they've just got to find the right one for them, which can be another minefield.  For me, they never did anything for my depression, although the GP will say I might be worse without them.

I've always found my GP of 13 yrs very cold.  Like you, I have often wondered if a follow up telephone call would have really been too much for his £100,000pa salary.  Over Christmas I was severely depressed.  My GP went from seeing me weekly/fortnightly to nothing at all for 3 months.  Yet, he turned his head away from me once when he seen me in reception, and a second time, when he had to walk straight past me.  Would it really be unprofessional to say, "Hi, I haven't seen you, are you okay?".  I've thought often about changing him, but the thought of starting from scratch with my complicated case feels too daunting. A few months before this I had actually confronted him about a couple of things I wasn't happy about.  Any time I've seen him since, he has tried that bit harder.  Although, the git still sits with his back to you as you walk through the door

[Michael Frankum]

Yes it was such a sad tale. It's always terrible when somebody chooses that as the only way out. I was on Sertraline a long time ago, and I remember my GP helping me to change from that to a new anti-depressant, but I can't remember exactly why, although I was hospitalised at the time for repeated self-harm. I know that 1 of the anti-depressants that I took was linked to people self-harming, but I'm not sure which one. So I'm no help really, but it might be worth checking with your practitioner. Best wishes. 

[Catbrian]

I'm sure it was Sertraline, Michael.  It got a lot of bad press and Doctor's went all out to get people off it.  In saying all that, there are people still on it today reporting goof effects, but that is the nature of AD's

[stewart]

Hi Mar, there are so many diferent anti D's out there, it is often a task in its self to find one that works best or each individual.

[mar42]

Hey stewart, i tried a few AD's before sertraline & had a different problem with each one,the one thing i can say 100% with sertraline for me is that it causes delayed ejaculation,which hasn't really bothered me being single for a few years now.It's a side effect i can live with (for now anyway) rather than not being able to function day to day at all. I periodically have problems with sleep,waking up a 2 at mo & again at 4,i also feel suicidal quite a bit,but don't think i would ever actually do it. I will never know whether these are effects of depression or side effects of ssri's???? i think i will be on these for life,i have been taking them for 10 years now. I suppose it's just the nature of this thing we all have & even though prescribed drugs have saved many peoples life,allowing them to function,so we know that they have been helpful,but i get weird sometimes thinking "are these pills keeping me in the depression loop"??????

[Catbrian]

Hey Mar

Sexual dysfunction is quite common on AD's.

I can relate to your feeling suicidal but not really thinking you'll ever do it.  I used to wish I were dead; would pray that I wouldn't wake up the next morning.  But, truthfully, I didn't really want to die, I only wanted the depression to be dead.

The longest I was on any AD was Citalopram for about 5 years.  Many other people are on the same meds for longer than 10 years, I suppose it is an individual choice.  I prefer to change because I believe they must loose their effectiveness after a while.  I went from one year to the next, taking AD's, but still largely feeling suicidal.  I used to protest to the GP and Psychiatrist that the meds were doing no good, but they will usually argue I could be in a worse state without them. Eventually, I insisted on trying these mood-stabilisers and a different AD and I really haven't looked back since.  Yes, the depression comes and goes, but not nearly as dark and NEVER suicidal.  TBH, at least it comes and goes, previously it was an never ending cycle of feeling depressed and feeling even more depressed!

Hope you're doing okay  0158

[mar42]

That's interesting catb,i would like to change AD,maybe to citalopram? but it's a case of (in my mind ) better the devil you know,the thought of ending up worse really scares me,i have to see my psychiatrist in april,not sure if to mention it? i feel a bit better today,but in general i just feel anyhow,never feel 100 % but who does catb? especially the situation at the moment (recession) & i don't think this cold weather is helping either. I mentioned in an earlier post i had a wonderful 4 days,about a month ago,a real spiritual experience,i started to think on the 3rd day,maybe?just maybe it's left me? no such luck     can you take 2 AD's at same time cat?

[Catbrian]

I understand your feeling 'better the devil....'.  Changing meds is a very personal choice, but it is worth discussing with the Psychiatrist in April.  They would never change without your agreement.  Sometimes I think too many people continue to suffer even after they've tried various AD's.  I also accepted that situation for around 12 years.  Of course, I still get down, like everyone else, but not half as bad as I used too.  As you say, the current economic climate and freezing weather doesn't help any of us.  There's nothing worse than worrying about finances.

I know there are people who take two different AD's, but that probably depends if the Psychiatrist is willing to prescribe.  My last and new Psych refused to prescribe two kinds.  What they did do, was prescribe a Mood Stabiliser in addition to the AD.  I believe it is the MS that made a huge difference to my mood.  I seem to have a high tolerance to drugs and the AD's alone just weren't doing it for me.

Hope your day's been kind to you 0158

[stewart]

with changing meds...if you are on a couple of tablets each can impact on the other and limit choices, eg, i wanted to change my trazodone to amytryptaline as the Traz wasnt helping me sleep any more and the aching joint side effect, doc could only do this by changing the AD citalopram to sertaline as traz + cital dont go well together