Author Topic: What are you reading at the moment?  (Read 9484 times)

BladeRunner

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #15 on: November 14, 2011, 05:27:45 PM »
Stevie, I absolutely understand your stance and think that George Carlin has expressed all of this in an absolutely hilarious way:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o[/youtube]

However, I hope no one here thinks this tone is wrong in such a debate (in a forum full of very sensitive people) because religion is kind of a delicate issue for many people, and of course I don't want to insult anyone['s beliefs]. But I think such opinions which many may deem a bit "radical" must also be addressed in a clear and unambiguous way.

Zaf

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #16 on: November 14, 2011, 05:32:15 PM »
I suppose I worded that wrongly, when someone says god what picture does it bring to mind?
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Zaf

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #17 on: November 14, 2011, 05:34:44 PM »
Stevie, I absolutely understand your stance and think that George Carlin has expressed all of this in an absolutely hilarious way:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o[/youtube]

However, I hope no one here thinks this tone is wrong in such a debate (in a forum full of very sensitive people) because religion is kind of a delicate issue for many people, and of course I don't want to insult anyone['s beliefs]. But I think such opinions which many may deem a bit "radical" must also be addressed in a clear and unambiguous way.

I cant get it to work on my ipad, can you give me the gist of what it says?!

You may be right that this discussion is inappropriate in here, I would hate to upset anyone :(
Certain things catch your eye, but pursue only those that capture your heart.

Got

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #18 on: November 14, 2011, 06:00:12 PM »
It brings to my mind the various human concepts of god. I have read many different concepts, ranging from the incomprehensible, to  childish. Its honestly a question I cannot give a simple answer to, as to me a God is a human concept borne out of the reasons I mentioned earlier. God is such a commonly used word, that people often accept it has a meaning, even if they don't beleive in a god.

I suppose the first thing that springs into my ind when people use the word god, is: a restriction of thought in peoples mind; a desire to put a name on something; a desire for people to seek a purpose and meaning beyond the realms of science; indoctrination; and blood, misery, fear, pain and war and a lack of liberal morals often combined with a stagnation of society.

By stangation of scoiety I mean entire countries laking the ability to properly care for, medicate, feed themselves, and an inability to properly study science, medicine etc. I realise that often other factors go hand in hand with this, but god is usually a major part of it as far as I can see. I've lost count of how many people I had to explain that their work cannot be submited to a journal of science, because they seem to see the reasons for their discovery as an act of god. I find it difficult when people devote their time to praying for a solution to their babies illness, or their poor exam grades, or their poor financial situation, instead of devoting their time to doing something that is actually going to help. I've worked in quite a number of 'developing' countries, and to see the danger of this  system of thinking is heartbreaking, and it worries me how many lives have been ruined, and even taken, by a beleif in god instead of common sense.

 I suppose that sounds more like I am describing religion, not god, and I realise people beleive in god without having a religion...although I beleive that as long as people belive in god, the organisation of religion will continue, and all that it entails will follow.

I'm sorry if that sounds in anyway rude, it isn't supposed to be. I have many good religious friends and have even lived in the houses of Muslims in the middle east. Religion is something that I have a strong interest in, but as far as I can see, to accept the reality of a god, is to dismiss all other alternative theories....and I find it ironic when people tell me I am small minded for not beliving in god.

These are just my opinions of course that I am offering for discussion puposes only....they arnt supposed to be inflamatory in any way....I enjoy this kind of debate alot !!! :D :D :D

I can see you probably wanted a more simple answer....but I cannot give one.

Got

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2011, 06:03:08 PM »

Yes.....I hope not to upset anyone.....its just opinions.....no offence intended to anyone at all. I feel that it is mature to debate anything in a respectful and sincere, mature way, as long as it is done politely and kindly..as we are al entitled to our own thoughts and we have a right to think and discuss..debate is the enemy of facism and arrogance!

BladeRunner

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2011, 06:09:38 PM »
Regarding Carlin's little speech, you should bear in mind that it's a standup comedy act, albeit about a serious subject, and thus he of course simplifies and exaggerates things. I think the "brutality" of the wording and ideas should serve to incite discussions. I copypasted the gist of this act from wikiquote:

Quote
  (..) Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time...But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He's all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can't handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bull&$%+ story. Holy &$%+!
    But I want you to know something, this is sincere, I want you to know, when it comes to believing in God, I really tried. I really, really tried. I tried to believe that there is a God, who created each of us in His own image and likeness, loves us very much, and keeps a close eye on things. I really tried to believe that, but I gotta tell you, the longer you live, the more you look around, the more you realize, something is ****** up.

    Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed. Results like these do not belong on the resume of a Supreme Being. This is the kind of &$%+ you'd expect from an office temp with a bad attitude. And just between you and me, in any decently-run universe, this guy would've been out on his all-powerful ass a long time ago. And by the way, I say "this guy", because I firmly believe, looking at these results, that if there is a God, it has to be a man.

    No woman could or would ever **** things up like this. So, if there is a God, I think most reasonable people might agree that he's at least incompetent, and maybe, just maybe, doesn't give a &$%+. Doesn't give a &$%+, which I admire in a person, and which would explain a lot of these bad results.

(..)

I think he of course makes these points from the view of a disgruntled ex-believer brought up as a catholic (like me :D), so the concept of god he rants about is a very catholic and vengeful one - but we were in fact still taught such stuff, and this is really the concept conveyed to us, so I think it's legitimate to attack this specific concept - not all believers of course! But please tell me if the text upsets anyone, I can delete it, but didn't really find a useful link so I wanted to copy it for you ;)
« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 06:59:22 PM by BladeRunner »

Zaf

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2011, 06:33:04 PM »
I think you're right Stevie that 'god' is the desire to put a name to something, I thonk Taoism says that if you can name it or describe it then you've got the wrong thing.

Most people I ask that question go for an omnipotent being and their beliefs strongly resemble the quote from bladeruner (I do like the assumption god is a man and the reasons behind it!)

Definitely not rude, thought provoking if anything, I'm always curious how people think of god and religion so tell me off if I ask too many questions!

Thanks bladerunner, It makes me think of a rather naughty joke that was going round the pagan forums a few years ago!  Perhaps if anyone objects to this discussion/debate we should delete it all but in the meantime (with my moderators hat on ) could you modify the F words to something else so as not to offend.


Certain things catch your eye, but pursue only those that capture your heart.

Got

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2011, 06:44:13 PM »

I think I need to make something quite clear here.

If god is an omniscient, omnipotent superior being, what you are actually refering to is me.

It is the logical conclusion to this debate, that, in fact, I am god, and I should be worshiped accordingly.

Just in case you are concerned, i'm joking.

Zaf

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2011, 06:47:14 PM »
 :D :D :D
Certain things catch your eye, but pursue only those that capture your heart.

Ally

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #24 on: November 15, 2011, 12:08:23 PM »
I'm reading Keith Richards autobiography Life.
It was give to me by a friend that knows I like to ready biographies, but I'm not actually a Rolling Stones fan.

Good book so far tho.

I want to get through this and onto the new Terry Pratchett book Snuff.
I'm really into the Pratchett Discworld books. Have been for years  :)

Cinderella

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #25 on: November 15, 2011, 12:23:17 PM »
I started reading ' Undoing depression' by Richard O'Connor about 3 weeks ago. Although there is not a lot of new information, I find some exersises very useful, like for instance 'the mood journal' or 'keeping a record of dysfunctional thoughts'.  I also regularly work with Louise L. Hay's : 'You can heal your life' and the affirmations have helped me in the last 20 years.

I am reading 'Robinson Crusoe', which is obviously fiction and I find a lot of comfort in the character and the way he lives alone on this island. At the moment he has just returned to the Island, after he has returned to England and got married etc. and he is describing what the people, he had left behind are doing. How they built a life on this deserted island.

Any suggestions on what to read after this?
I am not too keen on 'waiting for Godod'. When we read this at school, I found it too dull, but obviously it is a classic. I have also already read the ' the Hobbit' and seen LOTR.
I £$%

BladeRunner

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #26 on: November 15, 2011, 01:35:25 PM »
Difficult to make recommendations without really knowing what you're looking for - I actually don't really read any self help books regarding depression becuase I've only encountered not very useful ones (recommended by an even less useful therapist) and I search for any information in that regard on the internet. When it comes to fantasy, I am not very knowledgeable, either, but I would really recommend Neil Gaiman, in particular his rather sinister and imaginative graphic novel series "The Sandman" which displays a unique grasp of fantasy, taking place partially in the "realm of dreams" and in the real world and dealing with "real people" as well as the " Endless", which are personifications of dreams, death, despair etc. But it's not for everyone, and it took me a long time to decide whther I like it or not :D The good thing is that DC comics has made the first issue available for free, so everyone can make up their mind themselves about this: http://www.dccomics.com/media/excerpts/1696_1.pdf  [warning, might take some time to load]

I also really like his novel "American Gods", which deals with personifications of ancient mythological gods living in today's America - sounds kind of really weird (and actually it is), but it works really well and I love the novel. 

isserley

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #27 on: November 17, 2011, 01:17:16 PM »
I have just finished I, Partridge; Alan Partridge's autobiography by Steve Coogan and it was really funny/ cheered me up
Reading is my only comfort at the moment
Isserley

Got

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #28 on: November 18, 2011, 06:15:14 PM »

ha har!!!!!!!!!! Needless to say, I had the last laugh

hairyyahoo

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Re: What are you reading at the moment?
« Reply #29 on: November 26, 2011, 10:36:04 AM »
i tend to read a lot of sci-fi and fantasy novels. i'm a massive pratchett fan, especially when it comes to the city watch series (sam vimes is the man!). robert jordan's wheel of time series is simply amazing and raymond e fiest has some good stuff in his riftwar books. sometimes i like to dip into the self help genre but it's a bit hit and miss in my experience. some titles are pretty good but there's a lot of crap out there. feel your fear and do it anyway by susan jeffers was pretty reasonable even though i'm a bit cynical when it somes to NLP. the prophet and in the garden of the prophet by Kahlil Gibran are also two of my faves and although they do read like semi-religious poetry i'd recomend them to anyone, especially those of a spiritual nature (both can be read online for free by googling the title).

if anyone could recoment some decent titles in the self hep bracket i'd be forever grateful.


zaf, i'm also fascinated with questions about god(s)/religion.


I think I need to make something quite clear here.

If god is an omniscient, omnipotent superior being, what you are actually refering to is me.

It is the logical conclusion to this debate, that, in fact, I am god, and I should be worshiped accordingly.

Just in case you are concerned, i'm joking.

joke or not that's actually pretty close to my thoughts on god. not that stevie himself is god, that'd be a bit weird...i won't be laying the foundations for the church of stevie the magnificent any time soon, sorry to say mate ;). but if i were to ammend your words to i am god and so is everyone and everything else around me, and all should be worshiped accordingly in a kind of "everything is sacred or nothing is" way, then i think that'd strike pretty close to the mark in my mind. i view god as kind of a gestalt entity comprised of everything that exists everywhere ever, be it animate or inanimate, organic or otherwise, just without the human characteristics which make the idea of god more familiar and relatable to humanity. that's just my take on it and of course i have absolutely no proof, and i am heavily influenced by buddhist and taoist philosophy so it might seem like a bit of a mish mash of ideas but i like it none the less ;D
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